Sanja Milosavljevic: Hello, my name is Sanja Milosavljevic and I’m going to be your host today. Today, my guest comes from Argentina. Her name is Sofia and she’s a journalist. So, enjoy our conversation. Hi Sofia, how are you? 

Sofia Terrile: Hi, Sanja, how are you?

Sanja Milosavljevic: Well, I’m fine and as I spoke to a friend earlier, I’m so excited to have an opportunity to do this. To speak to some dear people and some dear friends from all over the world and try to share their stories and try to share their insights regarding not just COVID and Corona but their lives and their businesses. So, can you tell us something about yourself? I said that you are a journalist, but what is your educational background, what is your focus right now in your life? You mentioned that you finished some PhD, no? Master studies? Master studies, okay, I know you are young. You know, something- just an introduction to your story and your life.

Sofia Terrile: Sure! So, my name is Sofia Terrile. I’m an Argentinian, I also have a dual citizenship, I’m also Italian. That’s my surname Terrile. So, I’m a journalist. I cover economics and finance for a national newspaper, one of the two biggest in the countries. I also do some participations on TV. I am a regular comment- commentist? I don’t know if that’s the word…for a national- I don’t know how to say this in English (laughter) – for a TV show and like a daily newscast. A daily newscast. So that’s my job, I cover economics and finance in a country that is a mess in the economy (laughter). You know we have high inflation rates. Like, last year was I don’t know, around 54%. This year, in the past month we already had like 26% inflation. We have a currency crisis. We have- everything is like a total mess. You know, in this country, regarding economics. So I have a very stressful job as you can imagine (laughter). I studied communications and then I did my postgraduate studies in finance so I can get to know a little bit more about, you know, bonds and the stock market. We have a very small stock market. A very, very small stock market. And we have a mess with our severing debt, so I’ve been trying to figure out what’s been happening with our economy in the past six years that I’ve been a journalist in- for the economics and finance and business section in Argentina.

Sanja Milosavljevic: How come that you have chosen to work in economics and finance. I don’t think it’s for women or for men, but it’s a topic that’s very complex and very hard to understand. Sometimes some basic terms in economics are very confusing to me. So, how come you decided to specialize in this field?

Sofia Terrile: Right, so the opportunity actually came to me. I knew I wanted to be a journalist, so I knocked on every door I could – “Hey, can I get a job? Hey, can I get a job?”. You know, like that. Because – you know, here journalism works in quite an opaque manner. You know, we don’t have like LinkedIn, like job searches. You don’t type ‘journalism’ in LinkedIn and you find like a lot of job offers. It’s like very – it’s a closed circuit in which you enter by networking and by contact. So I’ve been knocking on every door ever since I can remember. And then a professor of mine, a teacher of mine at the University said “Hey, there’s an opportunity to work for the business sector in this big newspaper in Argentina, do you want to go for it?” And I said okay! Like, I don’t know how to divide numbers, I don’t know how to…but I was like okay, let’s do this. I’m always up for the challenge, you know I’ve been like that ever since I was born. So I was like alright, let’s do it. And at first I had my issues obviously because I thought it was quite a complex topic. And actually it was business, but I was 22 years old and I didn’t know much about business. But then I started finding my way, you know. And then for the last two to three years, I’ve been doing economy, you know, like macro-economy. So, I’ve been writing about inflation, currency crisis, all around economy. Not business anymore, because we’ve been in an economy crisis since 2018. So right now my profile is a bit harder than it was before. Like from the hardest parts in journalism. But I’ve been coping really more because I like my job. It’s challenging and it forces me to study a lot and to be informed. I really like that, I’ve found that I’m a bit of a nerd within the year, so I like that.

Sanja Milosavljevic: I think that’s fine, to be a nerd. I remember when we tried to arrange this interview, you said “Okay send me the topics so I can prepare myself and do the research”. So I said okay, Sofia, I will do that. (laughter). So, what are- just one more question and we can move on. What are the measures of your government to ease that currency crisis and inflation? Because I remember we had a similar problem 20-25 years ago and it was extremely- our inflation rate was, I don’t know 100% per day. Do they have any measures that are sound, that you can really relate and try to recover economy.

Sofia Terrile: If I have to give an honest answer, I would say n- we switched governments December last year and neither the previous government nor this government have the recipe, you know? It’s still a mess, I think. You know? Because- I don’t know, we still didn’t find our way because, for example in 2018 the previous government asked for a loan from the IMF, you know, to make things right and to start. But then everything- we had a big currency crisis. The peso, our national currency, devaluated a lot. We had big inflation. I think it’s a matter of trust, you know, in our currency? We have a bi-monetary economy without looking for it. I think it’s a matter of trust in our currency and in our institutions that right now is like, it’s bad. And we still haven’t- I have to be honest, we still haven’t found our solutions. I mean, we have some solutions like short-term solutions. For example we set maximum prices? I don’t know if you say that way in English. We set the standard prices for food and for, you know, basic necessities- basic articles, yes, but then those are like short-term measurements. I think we would need- and everyone here thinks we would need something more than short-term measurements. We have been an inflationary economy for so many years now. We don’t grow since 2011. It’s getting- I don’t want to say worse each year. We have some years where it’s better than the year before, but then we just…we’re like this, you know? It’s difficult.

Sanja Milosavljevic: So how did COVID and Corona influence your vulnerable economy? Your economy that is already in a problem? How does- do you see, you and your government, do you see an opportunity in this pandemic, or is it just…I don’t know, a shortcut to an even worse economy state?

Sofia Terrile: Right. So, we had a lot of macroeconomic issues before the pandemic. Actually we had to- this government started – this government in December 2019 – knowing that it would have to renegotiate our severing debt. Because we had a lot- a big debt and no dollars to pay for this debt. So, it already had a big challenge. I mean, we entered default, we’ve been a country in default for a few weeks until the government finally arranged with bond holders. But we already had a mess, you know, before we entered the pandemic. Once we entered the pandemic, this only got worse, you know? I’m sorry, I think I’m the pessimist in this podcast.

Sanja Milosavljevic: No, no, no – you’re not. We’re actually trying to share honest stories. It would be- only if someone from China tells me that their economy is recovering tells me their economy is recovering, I’d say okay I believe you. But if somebody from- especially from the third countries or a country like Serbia, when they’re full of, you know – well we are recovering. Well, it’s not that possible and it’s not possible to do that so fast.

Sofia Terrile: So, up until now we have 1.3 million Argentinians infected with COVID-19. Even though we had as I told you, before when we were chatting before this podcast, I told you we had quite a strict quarantine for around 8 months or so and we are right now in social distancing measurements since like the 10th of this month. So even though we had this strict lockdown and quarantine with many activities closed, many activities still closed, we had 1.3 million Argentinians infected with COVID and around 37 thousand people that have died. We are right now likely 8th country with the most COVID infected people, I don’t know if you understood that-

Sanja Milosavljevic: Of course.

Sofia Terrile: So it hasn’t been easy on the COVID side, but also it hasn’t been easy on the economy side. Because for example let me give you some numbers. In six months in Argentina poverty has gone up from 35.5% to 40.9%. That means around 4 every 10 Argentinians are poor. So that’s a very strong number to start with. You know, around 18.5 million Argentinians are poor. We have around 45 million Argentinians in the whole country, so…you can imagine how bad this is. And then, as I told you before, from January to October we already had 26 point something inflation. That’s a big inflation for a country that already has some problems, but I mean – it shouldn’t have that inflation, you know? And also we have some currency issues, you know, inflation rates are rising and in the middle of this we had negotiations for a severing debt and right now we are negotiating with the IMF because of the loan which we contracted in 2018 to solve our crisis. So it is expected that some of the measurements that I can tell you now that our government applied for the economy to get better. Some of those measurements are right now disappearing. So I think we will now see the cruelest, the worst side of the pandemic.

Sanja Milosavljevic: So, what happened to- or, let me just rephrase. Do you have a large number of small and medium enterprises in Argentina? Are they the holder of economy developments?

Sofia Terrile: Yes, that’s interesting. Because around 9 out of 10 jobs are sustained by small and medium enterprises. You know, it’s the backbone of our economy. We have big companies in Argentina, but actually we have thousands and thousands of smaller companies that are the backbone of our country that actually struggle the most when things like this happen – the big economy crises and the pandemic that came on top of it.

Sanja Milosavljevic: It’s like a cherry- a reverse cherry on top. It’s like something you don’t want. So, what happened to the small and medium sized enterprises in this pandemic? Plus, I suppose that your borders were closed? Or open? They were closed?

Sofia Terrile: Our borders? Right now, we have some special flights, but we had our borders closed for a lot of months. We then started doing some special flights for- repatriation flights for bringing people back to Argentina. We then had some special flights, so if you want to travel, you had to sign like a- I don’t know how to call it in English – you had to compromise yourself that you will return and then do quarantine. And right now for example in the city of Buenos Aires the borders are open to receive tourism from other provinces or from other countries, but the government has announced that everyone who wants to enter the city of Buenos Aires has to do a COVID test.

Sanja Milosavljevic: A PCR test? 

Sofia Terrile: Yes, that’s it! I didn’t know if that was the word in English. (laughter)

Sanja Milosavljevic: (laughter) Yes, it is.

Sofia Terrile: So, yes, you had to do a PCR test if you wanted to enter Buenos Aires. So, I’d say it isn’t easy to travel and the borders have been very closed for a lot of months. But for example, if you look at it from an economic side – as I told you before, we had a shortage of dollars, right? We don’t have dollars in our economy, so that’s a big issue in Argentina. So, tourism is a big form of where these dollars go, you know? We have a big deficit because of tourism here in Argentina. Because more Argentinians leave the country than international tourists that enter the country. So we have an issue there. Because I think the crisis would be worse- even worse, if the borders were open. I don’t remember what was your original question because we got distracted by the border thing?

Sanja Milosavljevic: No, never mind, but I was just wondering like, if you have borders that are closed, like you cannot have tourists from the outside, from the other countries. Plus the export business can also suffer because the procedures are more complex and stringent than before. So, that everything influences the economy. So that was my question and you basically answered my question, so…yeah.

Sofia Terrile: No, that’s interesting that actually you mentioned importing and exporting. Because here in Argentina we have five- four? Five! Five foreign exchanges. We have like, you know, the official dollar. And then we have some financial dollars and then we have black-market dollar. So the difference between the official exchange rate and the parallel market, the informal market, went up to 150% this year. So, yeah .We have like the official foreign exchange rate is like – they have stepped on it so it doesn’t generate more inflation. But it is difficult for us Argentinians to access this official dollar. For example-

Sanja Milosavljevic: Can you- sorry, can you explain more?

Sofia Terrile: Yes, sure. So, for example – I cannot buy official dollars. Because there has been a restriction for everyone. For example, in my case it was because of the condition of my work. But then there is a list of about 10-11 conditions that take you out of the official dollar market. So, for example – four million Argentinians bought dollars in September, for example. And then they started doing these restrictions, right? So that people don’t access the- so, bans now estimate that from 4 million dollar- 4 million Argentines that have bought dollars in August-September, right now we would have around 700 thousand people. So you know? The official market is like this, like very, very small. And then, the parallel market, the informal market and the financial dollar market are getting bigger each day and by bigger I mean they are getting more demand every day. So, that’s why the prices are going up and going up and going up. And, I was mentioning this because when you see this, when you see parallel exchange rates going up, people that export and import goods start to think. Like, calculate, you know? This dollar, this parallel dollar is going up. The official dollar will have to catch up any time soon. So, they are speculating that there will be a devaluation of the peso. So, that behavior turns out that it generates more imports. Because people, you know, freak out. You know, importer wants to access the official dollar and they say “Okay, so if I have to pay this one peso today, or seven pesos – just to set an example – tomorrow I will accelerate my imports and bring more imports to the country.” But then, when you export, you have to turn the dollars that you generate into pesos, right? Here in Argentina. So imagine if I’m an exporter – I don’t know if you say exporter, but – if I’m a person that exports, right? If I can get seven pesos instead of one, I will hold, I will wait and I will turn my dollars into pesos when this evaluation that I’m imagining occurs. So this generated a mess. A mess in our foreign- in our trade.

Sanja Milosavljevic: What is the- it’s a silly question, but do you know what is the most imported good in Argentina? 

Sofia Terrile: It’s like machinery? You know, for- yeah. Machinery. And we export a lot- we are a food producer. A food producer. So, we are a very- we export soy beans and I don’t know how to say this in English but you know cereals and all that. Three out of ten dollars that we generate come from the food production.

Sanja Milosavljevic: Food production. Well, I know that we have some wine here in Serbia that come from Argentina like Malbec. And I think some fruits come here from- but I’m not sure, I’m not sure.

Sofia Terrile: That may be true because we are a big apple producer. But those, we call them ‘regional economies’. The wine, the apples. For example the wine is on the west side of the country and they have a nice climate and the sun is nice there, so they produce wine. But I would say it’s a bit of a niche export. But it’s not our biggest export. Because our biggest export would be cereals. Then, the automotive industry. Here, we have quite a strong automotive industry and we have an agreement with Brasil. We have a very strong neighbor. You know, Brasil is a very pushing economy, it’s strong, it has a lot of population. We have an agreement with them, we exchange cars with them. So, the automotive industry is actually like a big export in Argentina. Then plastic, then we have oil, we have big- we have a lot of natural resources! It’s a good country, I like my country, it has a lot of benefits but then it’s just a mess in the economic side.

Sanja Milosavljevic: I know, I can say a similar thing about Serbia. When you look at the map of Serbia, you have like huge plain on the north of the country, then you have a lot of rivers, then you have mountains and woods and- we only don’t have sea. We basically have everything you need to produce let’s say food. Would it be too much if I ask did your government help in any way small or big enterprises during the pandemic? During the time when they couldn’t make income or profit?

Sofia Terrile: Right, so let me do some disclaimer first. So, I’m a journalist, so I will always be critical of the things the government does. This does not have to do with my ideology. In my country luckily I can express my opinions freely. So, having said that, I would say that the government has done- has taken some measurements on a more social side. For example it has set some subsidies for companies so they can pay their wages. It has set an- how’d you call it…like an emergency fund for people that can’t- so let me get this straight. In Argentina we have high, very high poverty rates – around 40%. And then we have around a third of the economy that is informal. So imagine that you’re an informal worker. You work and you recieve cash for your work, but you have to move around to get that cash. You do not get that money in a bank, you do not get that money via electronic payment. So imagine being a construction worker that works in the informal economy and then lockdown gets here. You know? That’s where they- that was the worst part I think of this lockdown. Because there were a lot of people that lost their jobs that did not have an income, that depended on moving around the cities to get an income. So, the government tried to do some emergency funds, you know, some- it set up like these subsidies for companies. I would say those are the two biggest measurements that they did. One is called “The program of assistance to work and protection” and the other is called “The emergency family income”. So, even though we had these measurements, unemployment has gone up. I mean it has gone from 10.4% in the first quarter to 13.1% in the second quarter and let me tell you something quite crazy about my country – there is a prohibition to fire people.

Sanja Milosavljevic: Sorry, can you- can you repeat, sorry, can you repeat?

Sofia Terrile: You cannot fire people. You cannot fire people, there is a prohibition. It’s prohibited. 

Sanja Milosavljevic: So, what do they do if they want- what would be the solution for that?

Sofia Terrile: There is actually no solution. That’s why they came up with subsidies so they can pay for most of the employees salaries. Because there were companies, you know, their utilities came to zero these months. So, they came out with these subsidies. And then, I would say many companies just tried to, you know, close its doors. Disappear and then resolve in the justice- in the court. Because it’s a mess. It’s a mess. You know, I’ve been writing a lot of articles about closing businesses. And closing business in Argentina has become very difficult because of this. Because you can not, you know, fire people. You can not, you know, adjust your cost when there’s a problem or a crisis. So, even though we have prohibition on firing people, unemployment has still gone up. And that’s why I’m telling you that we have short-term measurements that have helped until now, but we are right now negotiating with the IMF and you know- if you know a bit about the IMF, you must you know that they do not give money freely. They ask for things in exchange. And these things mean like making- taking measures that are not nice. You know, that are not happy for people. So I’m guessing that- my guess is that we still haven’t seen the worst part of the COVID crisis, of the economic crisis because we still have everything so regulated. So artificially regulated, that we still have to see the cruelest side of this I think.

Sanja Milosavljevic: The ugly face of pandemic and crises. So, what do you expect? When is this going to end? Is it next year, is it in five years? You. You as a citizen of Buenos Aires. 

Sofia Terrile: So, I would say my utopic, wishful thinking. I would say this country needs good political arrangements so we can establish long-term policies. For example, we will not print a lot of money. Even though we need it, we would try to be restricted to our budget. You know those like fiscal policies that are serious and sustainable. But, this is a mess. We have big political confrontations. Like the US, like we are seeing right now in the US, we have had this for a lot of years in Argentina. Like political tensions. So I don’t think this will happen. But let me tell you that this year, the economy will go down around 11.9%. This is what private estimations are around right now. And next year we will recover some of that, like 5.5%. We will recover some of that that is the projection, but then I think we will need a few more years to get on track. And then as I told you before, some stronger measurements like stepping on prices and prohibiting things and you know like – sustainable long-term policy is what my country is lacking right now. 

Sanja Milosavljevic: Can you tell us something about the state of entrepreneurship in Argentina? Like, are they in some industries more often or in some other industries? Like IT, or the food sector? Where do you see most of entrepreneurial spirit or entrepreneurs? 

Sofia Terrile: Yeah, so we have a very entrepreneurial spirit in Argentina. Do you know, Sanja, what a unicorn is? I imagine you know what a unicorn is.

Sanja Milosavljevic: Yes, yes, of course I know.

Sofia Terrile: They are companies that are evaluated in more than 1 billion dollars. So, we have five of these. You know? It’s- for a macro-complicated country we have a very big entrepreneurial spirit. So we have a big e-commerce and like a big e-commerce and by big I mean one that is competing against Amazon. That is called Mercado Libre. It’s a regional e-commerce that was born in Argentina and it’s a great example of how things can scale even from a complicated economy. Then we have a software company that works for a lot of countries, I don’t know, many, many countries – big, big clients. Then, we have a cyber-security company. Then we have another e-commerce that is a unicorn and then we have a big regional ITA? Is that how you call them in English? Like the tourism platforms to get an airplane ticket and to get hotels and all that?

Sanja Milosavljevic: Aha, okay, okay – I know, I know. I know what you mean. Like booking and-

Sofia Terrile: Like booking! It is of- you can book airplane tickets and hotels, everything. You can book your trip there.

Sanja Milosavljevic: It’s only for South America or for Argentina?

Sofia Terrile: No, no, they are all regional. They are regional companies. You know for example the software companies work for a lot of countries beside of Argentina. Here we have a very good service economy. We have a good timing because we are GMT -3 I think? +3? I don’t remember. I think it’s -3. But we have like a good time zone for both Europe and then the US.

Sanja Milosavljevic: Or Asia…perfect.

Sofia Terrile: Yes, so we have a good time zone. And then we have- we have one of the best English speaking populations in the whole region. Because we have good bilingual schools and we learn a lot of English in schools. So, we have a good service economy that works offshore. For example we have hubs in the service economy for the biggest banks in the world. For example J.P. Morgan has a service hub here in Argentina. The software, as I said before, the software companies are very, very- they push a lot of here in the country. Yes and so I would say we have a very good entrepreneurial spirit and let me tell you something more – we are in constant economic crisis. The worst one, the most recent one was in 2001. We had a big devaluation. We went from dollar equals 1 peso to 4 pesos equals 1 dollar, so you can imagine the mess it generated in our country. So I would say this constant economic crisis and these constant issues get people to be more creative. You know? So that’s why I think we have interesting entrepreneurial spirit even though the macro-economy conditions do not help us.

Sanja Milosavljevic: Or allow them to grow or to show their potential. But, do you know of any successful stories from the food sector? Do you have any-

Sofia Terrile: From the food sector?

Sanja Milosavljevic: Yes, innovative- because I remember when we were I think in- was in Minneapolis? I’m not sure. We went to that small street market and you bought some artisanal cheese and some artisanal spreads…

Sofia Terrile: Yeah – North Carolina! We were in North Carolina.

Sanja Milosavljevic: North Carolina! Okay, okay, you’re younger than me!

Sofia Terrile: Every time. Yeah. I remember – we drank some wine and some cheese there, yeah…

Sanja Milosavljevic: I remember, I also remember that. Those were some of my favorite memories. I’m joking of course. But you mentioned that and you bought something like a souvenir for your family. But do you have something like that in Argentina? Like some innovative products that come from the food sector?

Sofia Terrile: Yes, I would say that we do have that. I would say that Argentina is actually a very innovative country  and a very creative country as I was saying before. We have good writers, we have good theatre plays, we have a nice  gastronomic scene. The city of Buenos Aires is spectacular. I can say it is spectacular. You know, I’ve been all around the world and I didn’t find a city like Buenos Aires. I don’t know, it’s like…it’s spectacular. I don’t have many other words to say. It is a fun city to be in, we have a really nice life. We spend a lot of time drinking wine and chatting and you know, it’s a very animated scene we have in Buenos Aires. And in some cities of Argentina like Cordoba in the center of the country and then Mendoza the wine making region, those are like nice- you know, nice people. People that have fun. And so, a very creative economy as I was saying before. So, some of the- I would say some of the most innovative food companies come from Argentina because we have- let me get this straight – you know, we have a big agricultural sector. So, a lot of those companies are working for that agricultural sector. We have from satellite companies that are born in Argentina. Big satellite companies. You can imagine- one is called Satellogic and it does nano-satellites, little, little satellites for the agricultural and for weather and for everything- you know, to look at Earth from the above. Then we have some smaller entrepreneurs. I remember we talked about this when we were together but people that are innovating with cricket flour, for example. People that are innovating with plant-based things in a country where meat and barbecue is one of the biggest resources in our country, we still have a lot of plant-based creativity here in Argentina. You know? I would say the food industry and the food companies and let me tell you something more – I’m remembering as we speak, you know? The food sector and the gastronomic sector, let me focus on them. They were very creative during the pandemic. You know? They started selling future tickets, so you could spend them after the pandemic ended. They sold boxes with instructions and with decorating in your living room so you could have a dinner party in your living room while you were in lockdown. Our refer- referees? I don’t know…that’s not the name. Like, the people that are pushing for this sector like chefs, bartenders – they were very, very present in the pandemic, like teaching people how to cook. You know there’s a big cook here in Argentina that is called Narda Lepes. She did like Instagram lives and you could tell her like “Hey listen I have a banana, flour and spaghetti. What can I make with this?” And she invented recipes, you know? And she’s a big star, you know, she’s on TV, she has a restaurant. But people here were very, very close to each other during quarantine and I would say the food sector is actually very innovative here in Argentina. We have a very good pasta making people, because-

Sanja Milosavljevic: I know and I follow some people producing pasta in Argentina. And I love them. I love watching their stories and their photos and their posts.

Sofia Terrile: Yeah, so I will send you some more. Because during quarantine a lot of people started making their own pasta from home and started selling it. And it was a great thing because we had- I don’t know a lot of these…sweet potatoes. You know, crazy combinations, colors and things…because we, besides the barbecue, aside from the meat, we have a very strong Italian tradition. Also we have Bolivian tradition. We have a lot of tradition from all around Latin America but also a big European tradition, and that’s why we eat- in Buenos Aires at least, we eat a lot of pasta, we eat a lot of Tiramisu. That is my favorite dessert ever. Yes. I would like this as well!

Sanja Milosavljevic: Okay, so we came almost to the end of this conversation. Can you just share your personal experience? Or your personal emotional status regarding this pandemic and quarantine and not being able to, I don’t know, see your friends and your family. And just share your message, share something with us. What will be your message to people who are listening to our podcast.

Sofia Terrile: Sure, I will try to- I’m inventing it, I’m thinking about it right now. So, I would say I’m a big extrovert. And this has been a big issue for me this year – to spend time on my own, to do things by myself. Because I always existed around others. You know? I always- my dining room – I open my dining room every week, so that people could come to my dining room and have dinner with other people and get to know other people. It was like a networking space I opened every week in my apartment. And then I did reunions and gatherings and meetings every week. I was the one to start the meeting, you know like “Hey, we can gather here!” So this year for me has been quite a journey, a personal journey. For example I started focusing more on myself. I would say it was a year of self-care. I learned how to cook – I didn’t know how to cook. Because I spent so much time in meetings and dining you know outside in restaurants. And as I said Buenos Aires is very assimilating so there’s so many restaurants to try. It’s like the New York gastronomic scene, you know? So I didn’t know how to cook and I’m 28 years old. And I’m not saying this with pride, I’m not taking pride in this. And I started doing a lot of sport because I didn’t pay attention to my body at all. Because I’ve always been on- I didn’t have any weight issues but I didn’t do any sports. That was bad for my mental health so I started checking on my mental health – what should I do to make this better? I started running. Running!  I mean I didn’t run anything – I didn’t even run after the bus. So I started running, I learned how to cook, I up-skilled, I improved my makeup skills. Because I had to do my own makeup because I work on TV and I had to do my own makeup. Because we do this Zoom TV right now, you know? So I had to do my own makeup so I upscaled my makeup. So I would say it was a year to focus on myself, on my studying. I studied post-graduate studies in finance. And it was- I mean, let me say this – I do not want to sound frivolous because I was one of the privileged Argentinians that could spend quarantine with a job and that could spend the quarantine with a fixed income. And that could spend quarantine in a space that has a garden. Because I live in a small apartment in Buenos Aires, but then I came to my parents’ house to spend some days here. And there I have a garden and a space where I can relax. And that is a privilege. And that is why I cannot complain, you know, about this year. And I think it’s a year- I read something like this morning that said “This year is not the year to set a goal or to think about things that you missed, but to be grateful for what you have.” And that is my mindset, you know? I’m grateful for what I had this year, even if it wasn’t the best year.

Sanja Milosavljevic: Ah, it will pass anyway.

Sofia Terrile: Yes, yes.

Sanja Milosavljevic: So, what will be your message? What would you share with people who are listening to this?

Sofia Terrile: Right, well I would say again – do not focus on your goals- the goals that you missed. Do not focus on what you haven’t done. The trip that didn’t result, the wedding that didn’t come because of the pandemic. I would say be grateful – be really grateful for what you have. I have a personal tip that I write down things, you know? Every once in a while I write down “I’m happy for this. I want to change this.” Writing is a nice exercise to remember that you do have a lot of things to be grateful for and happy for. And I do not want to sound like the ‘happy toxic’. You know the happy-toxic people who are like “You can’t be sad” – you can be sad. You can be sad.

Sanja Milosavljevic: That’s perfectly normal!

Sofia Terrile: Yes! You can be angry!

Sanja Milosavljevic: I agree with you. I go around and tell people well, you cannot be happy all the time, you cannot smile all the time. Because it’s either you have botox or something is wrong with you and feeling happy. It’s perfectly normal to be down and to be blue. And to be- that’s life.

Sofia Terrile: So that’s my message – if you want to be sad, be sad! But remember you can be grateful for some things. I think we are the privileged ones that can sustain a job and that’s it.

Sanja Milosavljevic: Thank you Sofia, thank you so much for accepting to participate in this project. So dear people of the world, this was Sofia from Argentina. And this Mondopreneur podcast is about sharing stories of people who live around the world. The whole project is supported by the US embassy in Belgrade. And if you want, you can always follow us on social media on Facebook, Instagram, LinkedIn and then you can listen to us and watch us on YouTube and listen to us on audio platforms that are available here. So, be safe, stay good and stay in good health – see you in a week.