EP002: Dania Beckford, Brand Communicator & Body Positive Advocate in Jamaica
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Sanja Milosavljevic: Hi, hello, my name is Sanja Milosavljevic and I’m going to be your host today. Today, my guest is one lovely, lovely beautiful lady from Jamaica. Dania Beckford. She is a brand communicator and body-positive advocate.
Dania Beckford: That’s right.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Hello Dania, thank you for your time. Thank you for accepting my invitation to participate in this project.
Dania Beckford: It’s my pleasure.
Sanja Milosavljevic: So…yeah. So, can you tell us something about yourself? Can you introduce yourself to people in Serbia and in the world?
Dania Beckford: Okay, so I am Deh-nia Beckford, but Sanja calls me Dah-nia, which is fine. She gets to do that (both laugh). And I’m from Jamaica. I’m an entrepreneur here in Jamaica. And what I like to call myself a 50% entrepreneur, 50% employee because I’m also the director of entertainment in the Ministry of Culture, Gender, Entertainment and Sport. So, my business is that I own a fashion label that does resort-wear because Jamaica is a tropical country so we wear a lot of swimsuits and coverups. So, we do resort-wear, but we have a niche market. Our niche market is full-figured women. And one of the reasons why I chose to supply resort-wear for full-figured women is because even though we live in a tropical country, a lot of the fashion items that we have here are not for full-figured women and Jamaican women are curvy women. So, that seemed to be a problem to me. I had many problems growing up finding a swimsuit I loved to wear to the beach and I lived two minutes from the beach. So, I decided to sketch my own swimsuits. I got them made, I wore them, put them on Facebook at the time and other full-figured women started to ask me where did I get those. So I was like “You know, I made them”. And they were like “So, can we get some?”, and I’m like “Can you pay for it?” and they’re like “Yes!”, and a business started. So, that’s how we started. I call myself a body-positive advocate because even though my fashion label is specifically for full-figured women, we don’t discriminate against any woman at all. So as long as a woman is confident in her own skin, is confident in what she’s doing, then that’s all that matters.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Perfect, because sometimes I have a problem in finding a swimsuit or any kind of- any piece of a wardrobe. I am skinny, so,it doesn’t matter if you are skinny or you are full-figured, we actually share the same problems.
Dania Beckford: Exactly. Women’s bodies are very varied and we have always been taught either to not love what we look like, love what another woman looks like – which may not be what you look like – and so because of that, it causes a lot of problems. And also, the fashion industry have their own objectives when it comes to what a woman’s body is supposed to look like. And because we all love to see women on the runway and in the magazines, then we end up having these ideals for ourselves that we possibly will not, or may not fit in.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Yeah, I know…I can hear you. So tell mehow long do you run your business? Where do you place your products? Do you use- you said you use social media, but do you have any kind of website e-shop? How do you ship your products? Can people in Serbia or somewhere in the world buy your swimsuits?
Dania Beckford: Okay, so, we have been operational for four years. As a matter of fact, this- the entire story I told you about how we started, also happened outside the fact that I had multiple fibroids in 2015 and I was working at an advertising agency at the time, because I’m actually- my education is in marketing and public relations, so, I was on the brink of doing my Master’s in Integrated Marketing Communication and I was working at an advertising agency at the time, and I had this operation to do, so I had to take out like 15 fibroids. And I did the operation and I just didn’t feel like my body was ready to go to work again. And so, that whole story I told you about me designing the swimsuit and going to the beach a lot to get healing and posting it happened in that time when it was supposed to be such a- a challenging time for me, you know? So I took those four months and I started the business. Now, we were fully on Facebook and Instagram at the time and that’s where we found our home. So, it’s not actually a physical store. We are on Facebook, we are as BroadTail FitKinis, the name of my brand is BroadTail and it really just means a ‘big bottom’ and…that’s what…BroadTail means to us…yeah. (both laugh). Yeah, we are on Instagram at Official BroadTail and our website is actually now in construction because we have expanded. We have evolved into a semi-entertainment company. So, Carnival is a Caribbean thing, right? It’s where we have revelers go out in the street and you’re in costumes and you’re dancing in the street for an entire day. Now, this tradition started in Trinidad and Tobago and it’s- it’s throughout the Eastern Caribbean, but it has become really popular in Jamaica for the last twenty- twenty years. So, the last three years since I started my business, one of the bands here in Jamaica called Xaymaca, which is what our country was called before we changed it to Jamaica. They approached me to say, ‘you know, full-figured women are full in Jamaica’. We have so many curvy women. And because of how skimpy the- the suits are for Carnival, a lot of full-figured women, you know- they’d look, or they would wear a t-shirt under all, but they wouldn’t be in full costume like an average-sized woman. So, he approached me to say would I get into making Carnival costumes for full-figured women. And we started to do it 3 years ago so you know, we been evolving like that and because of evolving like that because a lot of persons from North America and throughout the Caribbean region comes to Jamaica for Carnival, the business started to grow which is when we were like okay, we need a- we need a- we need a website and we need to be shipping, so… The website is now under construction. We do ship to our customers who are mainly in North America, the UK, Canada and the Caribbean because that’s where the Jamaican diaspora really is and we do so through DHL. DHL is a partner of mine for shipping.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Perfect. Can you tell me something about the state of enterp- entrepreneurship – sorry – in Jamaica. And especially for the focus on ladies running their business. Is it- is it developed, is it under-developed, do you get any help from the state to start your business? Are there any kind of helps, accelerators and basically what’s the attitude towards…
Dania Beckford: Entrepreneurship?
Sanja Milosavljevic: Entrepreneurship, or in whichever branch they choose to work in.
Dania Beckford: Ok, so entrepreneurship traditionally was not something that was taught in schools. However, in the past 10-15 years where you know, have millennials coming up and they’re more entrepreneurial-minded, it has been taught in schools now. It’s not where it’s supposed to be here in Jamaica, but it’s also very much encouraged right now. And we have a lot of female entrepreneurs, not only in the formal sector, but also in the informal sector. Let me tell you what I mean by the informal sector.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Mhm, please.
Dania Beckford: So, unfortunately in Jamaica there are a lot of single mother families. And so, the mother usually has to not only take care of children, but also provide for them. And that has given way to very innovative ways of taking care of your children. Whether that means selling snacks on the road, having events during- for entertainment. So, there’s a lot of entrepreneurship going on with mothers in the informal sector. What I must say about the formal sector for entrepreneurship and women. We have- we don’t have a gender issue in terms of not being able to access the same type of resources that a man would be able to access. It’s pretty much across the board if it is that you want to start a business as a woman. However, what we do have, like many other countries, is the fact that there’s always not a lot of capital to start businesses, especially if you’re in a creative industry which I would be because of fashion. There are not a lot of investments immediately for things like that. What the state does have that I can speak to from actually my office at the Ministry of Culture, Gender, Entertainment and Sport is that for industry such as film, animation, music, creative production there is an incentive that you can actually get. So, if it is that you need to ship equipment from abroad here in Jamaica, if you are approved for this incentive by applying through the Ministry of Culture, the Entertainment Division, then you can actually get what we call ‘tools of trade’, duty free.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Ooh! Perfect! Perfect, perfect!
Dania Beckford: Yes, there is also- we have the Developmental Bank of Jamaica, DBJ, and what they have done, they have a couple of competitions that you can pitch for to get an investment for your business. It doesn’t have to be a creative industry business, it can be any business. They are also- they do a lot of grants. So, if it is that you don’t- sometimes you don’t get cash, but you’re able to get grants, or through their resources they’re able to provide you with things like a grant to get your website done, or to get some training. We also have an agent- agency called Jamaica Business Development Corporation, so what they do is that they do a lot of training and incubators for new entrepreneurs to- as a matter of fact I gave a presentation pre-COVID about branding your company. Because remember, I told you that my- my experience and- and my knowledge is actually in brand communication. So they have these two-week accelerators where you’re able to go through branding your company, if it is packaging, they go through that marketing your company. So there are couple of things here that can equip you as entrepreneur, but also because our economy is tight, it’s constricting, you know, there is not a lot of money, but there is a lot of training available.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Mhm. And do people actually use this kind of help? Are they interested in starting and running their own businesses?
Dania Beckford: I find that a lot of young people are now interested in starting and running their own businesses.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Not intereste- not interested? Or interested?
Dania Beckford: Interested.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Aha, okay.
Dania Beckford: Yeah. So a lot of young people are interested in running their own businesses. I find that generation before mine, they were content to finding jobs that they would stay in for years and just be there growing in that job. But persons from my generation and even below. I actually, I- I’m amazed by persons who are actually younger than me, because they want to start businesses in high-school. Anything they love as a hobby they want to start a business out of it. I think it’s because with globalization they’ve seen other young people in other places doing it and so they want to do it too, and a lot of them are not really interested in working for anybody, they want to work for themselves. So, I’m- I’m interested to see what the next ten years will look like for Jamaican entrepreneurs.
Sanja MIlosavljevic: Oh, nice. The two of us, we met in- in America.
Dania Beckford: Yes.
Sanja Milosavljevic: We spent three weeks together on IVLP program, the exchange program. And we actually-
Dania Beckford: Where I was freezing and you are- you were fine. (laughter) Cause you were used to the cold.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Yes, I am used to cold. So, you- do you remember we went to visit Gramen Foundation, Gramen Bank?
Dania Beckford: Yes.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Do you think that the small grants or small loans would help people to easy-start their business? Or just invest in some, oh I don’t know, equipment and just start doing something.
Dania Beckford: It would definitely help. It would definitely help, because let me tell you something. Even though it is easy- the process, as in administration, to start the business is not hard in Jamaica, finding money for that business is difficult. It is easier to get a loan to buy a car in Jamaica than to get a loan to start a business. Because the banks are seeing that, well, well if it is that you can’t pay your monthly payment, we can come back for the car. But if it is that you’re not making money in this business, what do we have? So, a lot of banks are not willing and ready to just give you money to start a business, you know? Even if you show them the best projections. So I think that having a- a bank, which I think is what our Development Bank of Jamaica is trying to get to, that will be able to give you cash for your business, because let’s face it – small businesses need cash flow. So I am very grateful for the training and the grands, but small businesses need cash flow. So, we need more places that will be able to offer that money and invest in entrepreneurs.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Mm, good. So, now we all- we are all facing the same problem, COVID-19 it’s something that is happening almost at the same time, in the whole world. So, what’s the…what’s the situation in Jamaica? And can you tell us, just- can you share where were you when you first heard the news, or…I don’t mean the exact- the exact moment where were you-
Dania Beckford: Oh, I remember the exact moment.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Ah, you remember? You actually remember? (both laugh)
Dania Beckford: So…
Sanja Milosavljevic: Well, what- what was your first…reaction to that?
Dania Beckford: Okay, so, we got our first case here in Jamaica on March 10 of this year and…I remember I was actually in Montego Bay, which is one of our resort cities. We have two cities here in Jamaica, Kingston and Montego Bay and I was looking at a location to host a seminar about these fiscal incentives for people in the creative industry. And I was saying to my senior director: “You know, since we are in Montego Bay and it’s all about the beaches, let’s get a venue that they can actually see the beach” and all of that. And then there comes news on everybody’s phone via one of our newspaper companies on the app that we got our first COVID case. Now we all knew that this thing was looming, we were watching it on TV and we were like – we’re really just hoping that nobody brings it here. Because nobody in the country had it. It would’ve had to be an imported case and our country heavily relies on tourism. Because you know we sell our beautiful beaches and our music and all our creative input. So we know that it was inevitable that it would get here. So that’s where I was. I believed that a lot of people thought that it was just something that came and went. We locked-down our country pretty quickly. So, maybe 10 days after that first case we completely closed our border so there was no tourists come in. And country was estimated that we were losing three million dollars per day by not having tourists come in into Jamaica. Now, one of the- tourism is so linked to all our other industries, because it’s linked to our creative industry because not only do we sell our beaches and our beautiful landscape, but our music is very important to the world because we gave six genres of original music to the world, including reggae and dancehall, which a lot of our tourists come for. You’ve told me how much you love Bob Marley…
Sanja Milosavljevic: Of course… (laughter)
Dania Beckford: As a matter of fact – segway – I am in the Harry J recording studio, and this studio is like 50 years old. It is one of our legendary, iconic studios here in Kingstone and it is where Bob Marley recorded his first five albums. So all those wonderful songs that you know and love from Bob Marley, they were recorded right here. Right now feeling like an artist, (laughter) being here. And, importantly, it is now owned by his daughter Tara Johnson and she manages it. She’s the managing director. So, we’re keeping the women empowerment alive here in this recording. (laughter)
Sanja Milosavljevic: Perfect!
Dania Beckford: Right! So, I was talking to you about, you know, the impact that it has had. So, we had to shut down our industry- entertainment industry, which is big for us. It is estimated that, per year between our concerts, all the events we had, tourism, it is a 90 billion dollar entertainment industry that we have here in Jamaica…
Sanja Milosavljevic: And now, suddenly, zero.
Dania Beckford: It’s…it’s zero. Also, our agricultural sector. Because of tourism as well, our agricultural sector started to really suffer because they were not able to supply the hotels with agricultural produce, so…everything has been at a standstill. We have since, we were locked-down for almost six weeks. We re-opened because our government decided that we could not continue to be losing the money. And we re-opened at the beginning of July. There are some who would say that it was too quick of a reopening because since then we have had a complete spike in our cases. So, when we reopened, we were at about 500 cases and we are at 1.065. And in the past week, every day we’ve had about 19 cases per day. In the past week. So there has been a real spike between last week and this week. We are try-
Sanja Milosavljevic: So, are they going to take any new measures or put you in lockdown again?
Dania Beckford: It’s- it’s a very precarious position because two days ago our prime minister also announced the day of our next election, which is on September 3rd. So, usually when it comes to elections you can’t put a country on lockdown because there would be campaigning, there would be persons visiting your house, telling you to vote for them. There will be- people have to be able to get out of their houses to vote on September 3rd. So, I don’t foresee a complete lockdown happening pre-September 3rd, however I do believe that because the cases are spiking, he’s going to have to probably put in a stricter curfew. So, our curfew now is from 5AM to 11PM. Before this it was 5AM to 6PM and at one point when it was a complete lockdown it was 6AM to 3PM. So, I’m thinking that in the absence of a complete lockdown, he’s going to make the curfew times a little bit more stringent.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Mm. So, how did that affect people? Ordinary people? You are locked-down, you cannot go to your work, you have to shut-down your business. How did that affect? Did you just accept it, or did you have any kind of a reaction to that?
Dania Beckford: The persons-
Sanja Milosavljevic: Not just you, but, I don’t know- your friends, your colleagues?
Dania Beckford: Let me just-
Sanja Milosavljevic: Or did they just accept it as “Okay, that’s what we have to do now”.
Dania Beckford: For largely persons accept it because they saw what was happening with other countries, when you looked at the internet or you watched the news on TV. For example, at that time Italy had the most cases, America which we are very close to, geographically, and also because a lot of our diaspora resides in America. We saw what was happening there, so we knew that we had to lock-down. The trickle-down effect has been very great on the regular man or regular woman, with the smaller businesses. Because, they depend largely on larger businesses to supply them and- and generally with the smaller informal businesses the money that you make in a day is what you use to feed yourself and your family. And a lot of Jamaicans do live like that. So, it has been very difficult, especially for my- my- my- my colleagues in the entertainment industry. Now it has- it the- the complete shutdown. No events, no festivals, no- no music…it- it- it has been a really stressful- I mean, everybody is trying to go online right now and have some sort of live happening, but they’re not earning particularly from those types of things. I have an example. My best friend, she has been wanting to start her business forever in events, production and management. And she started her business in January and then there was a lot down in March. And she invested almost 5 million dollars in buying equipment, cause she’s doing event rentals as well. Equipment and everything and it has just been at standstill. So, it has been difficult on persons, but there has not been protesting because persons do understand. I mean, persons in the entertainment industry, they had to lobby a lot a phased reopening, which started…partially at the end of July, about July 19th, so events have started to happen but, it’s- it’s just with 250 people. Since then it has constricted because 250 people really can’t make no money for nobody in no event.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Of course, of course…
Dania Beckford: It was really for stress relief, because it’s not for profitability. But, we have yet to see what will happen after the elections and how this entire thing plays out. I feel like a lot of persons were frustrated, so…at the beginning they were scared, wearing masks, sanitizing and doing the social distancing. For the past couple weeks-
Sanja Milosavljevic: But do you do- sorry, but do you do that now? Here in Serbia we still practise social distancing, we wear masks, we wash our hands regularly…so, what- what’s the situation?
Dania Beckford: We have been doing it in Jamaica too, but I think that because persons were locked-down for so long, sometimes you don’t see them doing the social distancing. For example, Jamaica we are very touchy-feely type of country. We like to touch you, we like to hug you, we like to dance close to you, that’s how we are. So it has taken quite a bit of PSA’s, public service announcements on TV and on radio for persons to remember that COVID-19 is still here, don’t take it for granted, continue to be sanitizing…continue to wear your mask… (both laugh)… you know, it’s something. So, it’s still a learning curve for people, but I think with the spike in cases, persons are actually learning we need to do this thing in order to flatten the curve, so that Corona can just go away.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Mm…did you panic? Did you have any kind of issues with that? Like, you have a baby and you’re a mother. You’re responsible for- not just for yourself, but you’re responsible for another human being. Were you stressed? Were you depressed? Were you in problem? You have- you run your own business, but you still work somewhere else? What was your…”
Dania Beckford: To be very honest, I didn’t panic because…I was always watching the media to see what was happening. I knew it would’ve gotten here, I knew that I had to protect my child, so I didn’t even start him out at nursery. He’s 15 months old now, I didn’t start him in a nursery because I was like, you know, what’s- I’m watching what’s- to see what’s gonna happen with this new virus that we have. So, he has a nanny that comes in every day. When I started to actually worry is because the nanny is from an area that had to be on complete quarantine before the rest of the country was locked-down because they were having so many cases over there. So, I had to call my mother…that lives in St. Ann…about two-hours away from me, to come to Kingstone to- to take care of my child for me while I work. Because when I open up my computer all he’s doing is saying is “Apple! Apple!” and banging on my computer, I don’t get to work. So my mother came over and she had to help me, and I was saying to myself at least I had an option. I could call my mother to come and help me. What about other people who don’t have that option, you know? It- it really had some people worried. I- I spoke to some other women entrepreneurs who- even though I’m an entrepreneur, I have a job, so I was continuing to get a salary. You know? So, I had to stay grateful because there were other persons like my best friend who- she has no salary to get, because she just dive in the entrepreneurship, so…it was a different kettle of fish for some persons. So, whereas I knew I had options and resources at my fingertips that I could tap into, I was still worried and worried. Nobody was coming to my yard because you’re not going to give my child COVID. (laughter) It was never going to happen. As a matter of fact, he now hates his car seat because we haven’t been going anywhere in a car. So he’s like ‘what is this thing?’ So I’m wondering how am I gonna integrate my child in this whole car seat situation when we start going back on the road. (laughter) So there are other things that happened, but I- I haven’t been panicking. I’ve been trying to stay very calm, trying to keep a level head, and just- and just- doing the protocols so we can stay as safe as possible.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Mhm. And tell me- like, the thing you told me about your friend, and she invested a great deal of money into business that stopped.
Dania Beckford: Before it started!
Sanja Milosavljevic: Before it started. Well…it’s really a tragedy. How did your government react? Did- do they have any kind of incentives? Do they help people just to, I don’t know- they- they don’t have to pay taxes, or they don’t have to pay the rental space, or…what kind of help did your government and policy makers offered for the people that run their own businesses?
Dania Beckford: Ok, so, I must give them some credit because quickly they came together with a care package. The package- the whole thing was called C.A.R.E. it’s an acronym that I can’t remember right now, but it- we refer to it as the care package. And what happened is that they had relief in different areas for different types of persons. So, it was largely for the tourism sector. You had a lot of persons that were able to benefit from that, but you had to be registered, having a- what we call a tax registration number a TR number and you had to- if you didn’t have that and you were a business owner, you had to show proof that you were paying your taxes. So it was also a way for the government to ensure that everybody is now paying taxes. (laughter) So they had- yeah… (laugh). Some- (laughter). And a lot of entrepreneurs here, especially in the entertainment industry the taxideration is- you know…kind of iffy. (laughter). So, that was a way for them to get information while helping the entrepreneurs. My Ministry – Culture, Gender, Entertainment and Sport – we weren’t heavily included in that care package in the beginning and so, we had to lobby for our creative practitioners to get some sort of-
Sanja Milosavljevic: How come- sorry, but how come your Ministry wasn’t included in- in that care package?
Dania Beckford: We have a…cultural thing we need to fix here in Jamaica where we think the creative industry is so informal and we use it all the time for- for stress-relief for the people and to bring tourists to the country, but we don’t value it as much as we should. And so, because tourism was shut-down and it filtered into so many other industries, the package was- the care package was heavily focused on either tourism or agriculture. Now, our Minister Olivia Grange, who’s a woman, she had to lobby hard for us to have some sort of impact in giving incentives to the creative industry. And to date the money has not yet been dispersed, but we have come up with 40 million dollars for creatives to be able to get some sort of incentive.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Mhm. Good. Oof, that’s very…that’s very hard for the- especially for the countries that are in tourism sector. I think that’s…our tourism sector in Serbia is basically shut-down. People don’t have to- people are just shutting down their businesses and their offices, and…
Dania Beckford: We’re still on struggling too.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Of course!
Dania Beckford: You’re right, but what happened- when you- you do your pasta business!
Sanja Milosavljevic: I do my pasta business, but I had to transform a bit, like…restaurants don’t work, but people have to eat. So I just turn to physical persons instead of restaurants or…I don’t know, some other kind of- some other type of buyers.
Dania Beckford: What has given rise in Jamaica is that we weren’t big on delivery here in Jamaica. So, with COVID-19 we had a lot of deliver places popping up.
Sanja Milosavljevic: I know, I spoke to Feng from China, I told you, and she said exactly the same thing. Like, they had courier services earlier, previous- pre-
Dania Beckford: COVID-19
Sanja Milosavljevic: But now, she said that now they have, I don’t know- that’s the industry that is blooming, actually. Logistics and delivery services. So, how much did small businesses had to transform to adopt new business models or to work harder on their e-commerce platforms, or…how did they change? Do they value their customers and buyers more than they did earlier?
Dania Beckford: I think- I think- I think they have, for sure, as I mentioned to you, restaurants had to reimagine how they operated. So, you have a lot of curbside pickup and a lot of deliveries happening now. Almost everybody is a bearer right now. One time in Jamaica you couldn’t find a bearer – everybody is a bearer right now.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Really?
Dania Beckford: You know, so that- (laughter) so, that business has really boomed. Are starting to boom. Also with virtual setups for corporate companies now because they realize that all their meetings- because Jamaica, we were big on meetings. We like to meet. And we like to meet in nice places like hotel ballrooms and stuff. (laughter) So-
Sanja Milosavljevic: Same here. Same here. (laughter)
Dania Beckford: So nobody is meeting like that, all persons who are able to provide a virtual, corporate setup, that has started to be a feature of reimagining how your business work. A lot of entrepreneurs are really relying on their websites right now, because there- there are no walk-ins happening. So, those are- I think for- for Jamaica the- the gastronomy industry, the culinary industry is the one that I’ve seen that has been transformed the most.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Mhm. Do you see any light at the end of the tunnel?
Dania Beckford: There has to be.
Sanja Milosavljevic: What do you think, when you- of course- but, what do you think, when the- when- when- when will Jamaican economy recover? Or, start to recover? You said you had elections on the 3rd of September. Do you think that’s the day, or? When do you think the economy will start to recover? And what are the steps we have to make to recover the economy?
Dania Beckford: It- for me, based on how I see the trajectory of things happening, especially with the spike that’s happening with cases right now, I don’t think that we are going to be recovering until 2022. And, so, that’s an entire year from now. At the beginning of COVID, we were estimating that, ehhh, maybe this thing will pass by October. But, especially for the creative industry, because we heavily rely on events and, or music and culture, pushing our economy. There are no real big festivals that are going to be happening until…the end of next year, to 2022. Because…and even if these festivals start to happen, they have to be reimagined, because for two reasons. One: without a vaccine, persons are still scared to be in a crowd. Without a vaccine, persons who are actually hosting these big festivals that we usually have, have to put in so much more resources that they may not be making a profit from the events they used to make a profit from. So, it has to take a lot of reimagining. What I think the government has to do, we- in the very near future, like, pretty close after the election, we have to do another lockdown. Is my- is my estimation, in order to control the cases. Because what’s happening now is that, even though there are a couple that are imported, it’s starting to have community spread, which is what we don’t want, because then it’s harder to be able to control it and to contact-trace. We have persons who are working in large organizations that have large buildings that work close together that have to be shutting down because one person has COVID-19 and you’re not sure if you have to be testing everybody. So when you have that type of community spread, it’s time for a lockdown again. In this lockdown I believe that the government has to reimagine how it is that, one: they’re going to assist entrepreneurs and businesses to not fail, because small businesses are life-blood of countries, you know…as much as-
Sanja Milosavljevic: I know, I agree…I agree. That’s- that’s true…
Dania Beckford: And they’re not always noted for it, it is life-blood of countries’ economies and without them, the economy will suffer. So I think a lot of policies will have to be created in order to ensure that these businesses don’t close. And especially, I keep harping on the entertainment industry because it’s so important to us, because it’s so inextricably linked to tourism, that we must find a way through more testing, through better management of persons coming into the country to ensure that we don’t put our citizens at risk.
Sanja Milosavljevic: But…do you think that maybe you can postpone the elections for some other time?
Dania Beckford: That’s not going to happen.
Sanja Milosavljevic: September- is it- is it not possible, or do you have only one day in four years to do the election?
Dania Beckford: No, no!
Sanja Milosavljevic: Because if you-
Dania Beckford: We don’t have one year four years, okay, so actually, constitutionally-
Sanja Milosavljevic: I’m joking, I’m joking, of course, but…
Dania Beckford: I know (laughter) I know. Constitutionally, the election must happen by February 2021.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Okay.
Dania Beckford: At the beginning of the COVID-19 entering our country, our country was lauded by other country leaders that see that we did well in containing it. With the spike happening, our prime minister, in my estimation, because I’m a brand communicator and I watch the PR, he is losing PR traction. Because the spike is happening. Also we have had a number of corruption cases over the past four years and he’s losing credibility. So, if I were a politician, as bad as it sounds, now is the right time to call it, so that you can have- be over it, so that you can put in strategies. But, as a citizen, I don’t think it’s the correct time. But, I guess it’s between it’s what’s ‘right’ and ‘right-er’.
Sanja Milosavljevic: I know, we had a similar situation in June this year, and…we had two spikes, actually. We had one spike and then we thought everything is going to be fine. Then we had the election day, then we had another spike, so…it’s just experience from our country. What now…okay, so, what’s the…do you ever think that…you want to go back to, I don’t know, December, or- I don’t- February 2020? Would you like to return to that innocent time? Because, for me, it’s the innocent time. Now, we have to be more careful, more cautious, we are wearing masks, sanitize whatever, we don’t even trust our neighbors. So, would you return to that period of time, or do you- (laughter), do you just want to embrace the change that this is going to bring us all?
Dania Beckford: It’s a bit- it’s two-fold for me. So, in February we were celebrating reggae month. It has been one of the most successful reggae months. You were supposed to be here in Jamaica for Bob Marley’s birthday celebrations on February 6th.
Sanja Milosavljevic: I know…I know…
Dania Beckford: So, it was a very happy time for us in February. We were celebrating our music, it’s 50 years that our music has been given to the world as in reggae music and so it was a great time for us. We were in a celebratory mood. So I would love to get back TO that. However I do believe that for whatever reason, everything happens for a reason. I do believe that we needed to have a reset. Is this the type of reset that I imagined? Never. But I also believe that a lot of other industries will emerge out of a crisis like this. Personally, my…my mantra is- is ‘find the…find the opportunity in the crisis’. And so, with all the conversations I’ve been having with fellow entrepreneurs, that’s what I’ve been seeing. What can you do out of this crisis that will allow us to either find- have a new skill, make our businesses better or make our lives better. For me, I’ve become a more patient person. I was never a patient person, I’ve been praying for patience forever. And what I have realized is that patience is not just waiting, it’s how you wait. And so, I have been just trying to upgrade myself with trends that have been happening in fashion and in marketing, so that when I reimagine my company – because ain’t nobody goin’ to no damn beach right now. No beach. They have locked down thirty beaches here in Jamaica. So, a lot of persons are not buying swimsuits. But in this time, I have created new styles. I have been talking to people about having a virtual fashion show. Because I wanted to have BroadTail fashion week this year, that never clearly worked out and is not gonna work out for the rest of the year. But, it is pulling out of our minds different ways of doing things. And I also feel that even for my entertainment industry here in Jamaica, maybe the big festivals will not happen, but I think that a new crop of event promoters will come out of this. Maybe small intimate is what we’re supposed to be doing. Maybe it’s a different- maybe- or a boutique, hotels with smaller persons and villas that were complaining that the bigger hotels were taking up everybody. It will have other people emerging and I feel like when the chips fall, I’m hoping that not a lot of my citizens and citizens around the world die, but I…I know that something good must come out of it.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Mm. I agree, I agree. So, who would say we- we come to an end of our conversation?
Dania Beckford: I felt like it was two minutes.
Sanja Milosavljevic: It passed really quickly.
Dania Beckford: Yeah.
Sanja Milosavljevic: So, what will be your message to the world? What would you like to share with people here in Serbia and in the rest of the world?
Dania Beckford: Other than listen to reggae music?
Sanja Milosavljevic: Listen to reggae music! That’s- (laughter) that’s just common sense! That’s basically common sense! We all have to listen to reggae.
Dania Beckford: Okay, well, my lesson to the world is that – find- find- find the opportunity in the crisis. There is always a way to emerge stronger out of situations. Reimagine how you do things. I think that this period has pushed us in our brains because we were probably too comfortable with the way the world was, with all the challenges that were happening and everyday we were going about our normal business and then one day we got up and the entire world is facing the same thing. Which is probably also a uniting factor. To say that, maybe, if it is that we put our- our- away some of our classist tendencies, or racist tendencies, or any quality tendencies and- and just try to make the world a better place through growing something together, we will actually be able to reimagine it and do it and…one very important thing, Sanja, is that reggae music has always been the heartbeat of my country, and also one of the types of music that gives you healing during times of challenges, because it was born out of a time of major challenges in my country, so…while you are reimagining your life, listen to reggae music.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Thank you so much. I really appreciate your time, I really appreciate that you woke up this morning at five o’clock to make our local time.
Dania Beckford: Yes, cause you are my girl! I would do it for you! You were the first person to offer me a coat and scarf when I was freezing in Washington and pregnant. So, I would do anything for you. I’ve never forgotten it.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Aw, thank you so much. And I hoped if you want to start a similar thing in Jamaica, I can help you with old experience now I have, so…
Dania Beckford: I think that it’s a wonderful project you have been doing and want to congratulate you for doing it. And it really has inspired me to talk to some women around the world too, about what they have been facing and how we can overcome it together, because the future is female, right? I don’t think the men…
Sanja Milosavljevic: The future is female.
Dania Beckford: Yeah, it is…
Sanja Milosavljevic: Thank you, hugs and kisses from Belgrade!
Dania Beckford: From Jamaica.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Cao!
Dania Beckford: Bye!
Sanja Milosavljevic: Dobar dan, moje ime je Sanja Milosavljević i biću vaša voditeljka danas. Danas je moja gošća, divna i lepa žena sa Jamajke. Denja Bekford. Ona je Brend komunikator i zagovornica pozitivnog stava prema telu.
Denja Bekford: Tako je.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Zdravo Denja, hvala ti na izdvojenom vremenu. Hvala ti što si prihvatila moj poziv da učestvuješ u ovom projektu.
Denja Bekford: Zadovoljstvo je moje.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Da… Da li možeš da nam kažeš nešto o sebi? Da li možeš da se predstaviš ljudima iz Srbije i celog sveta?
Denja Bekford: U redu, dakle, zovem se Denija Bekford, ali Sanja me zove Danija, što je u redu. Ima prava da me tako zove (obe se smeju). I dolazim sa Jamajke. Ja sam preduzetnica ovde na Jamajci. A za sebe volim da kažem da sam 50% preduzetnica a 50% zaposlena, jer sam i direktorka sektora Zabave u Ministarstvu kulture, roda, zabave i sporta. Vlasnica sam modnog brenda plažnog programa jer je Jamajka tropska zemlja i mi dosta nosimo kupaće kostime i parea. Dakle, proizvodimo plažni program ali imamo i nišu na tržištu. Naša niša su krupnije žene. I jedan od razloga zašto sam izabrala da se bavim proizvodnjom plažnog programa za krupnije žene je taj, što iako živimo u tropskoj zemlji, mnogi komadi odeće koje možete naći na tržištu nisu za krupnije žene a Jamajčanke su žene sa oblinama. Dakle, u tome sam videla problem. Dok sam odrastala imala sam problem da nađem kupaći koji bih volela da nosim a živela sam na dva minuta od plaže. Tako da sam odlučila da nacrtam svoj kupaći kostim. Sašila sam ga, nosila, stavila na Facebook a onda su me druge krupnije žene pitale gde sam ih nabavila. I ja sam bila u fazonu: “Znate, sama sam ih napravila.” A one su bile u fazonu: “Pa, možemo li i mi da dobijemo jedan?” na šta sam ja odgovorila: “Možete li vi to da platite?” i one su pristale i tako je posao počeo. Dakle, tako smo počeli. Sebe zovem zagovornicom pozitivnog stava prema telu, jer iako je moj modni brend specifično namenjen krupnijim ženama, mi ne diskriminišemo ostale žene. Sve dok se žena oseća pouzdano u svojoj koži i u onome što radi, samo je to važno.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Savršeno, jer ponekad imam i sama problem da pronađem kupaći kostim ili bilo koji drugi komad odeće. Ja sam mršava, tako da nije važno da li ste mršavi ili krupniji, imamo iste probleme.
Denja Bekford: Upravo. Ženska tela su različita i uvek su nas učili da ili ne volimo kako izgledamo, volimo kako druga žena izgleda – što ne mora da se poklapa sa vašim izgledom – i zbog toga se javljaju mnogi problemi. I još, modna industrija ima svoje ciljeve kada se radi o tome kako bi žena trebalo da izgleda. I zbog toga što volimo da vidimo žene na pisti ili u časopisima, završimo sa tim idejama da se nikada nećemo uklopiti.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Da, znam, razumem te. Koliko dugo vodiš svoj posao? Gde plasiraš svoje proizvode? Da li koristiš, kažeš da koristiš društvene mreže, ali da li imaš vebsajt i e-shop? Kako šalješ svoje proizvode? Da li ljudi u Srbiji ili bilo gde drugde mogu da kupe tvoje kupaće?
Denja Bekford: U redu, dakle, operativni smo već četiri godine. Zapravo, cela priča koju sam ti ispričala o tome kako smo počeli, desila se jer sam 2015. godine imala višestruke miome na materici, i radila sam u tom trenutku u marletinškoj agenciji, jer se po obrazovanju bavim marketingom i odnosima sa javnošću i bila sam na korak od odbrane mastera u oblasti integrisane marketinške komunikacije, i morala sam da idem na tu operaciju i izvadim 15 mioma. I završila sam sa operacijom i nisam osećala da je moje telo spremno da se vrati na posao. I tako, cela ta priča koju sam ti ispričala, kako sam dizajnirala kupaći kostim i odlazila često na plažu je deo isceljenja i desilo se u vreme koje je trebalo da bude izazovno za mene, znaš. Tako da sam pauzirala ta četiri meseca i započela sam svoj biznis. Sada sam smo na Facebook-u i Instagramu i tu smo našli svoj dom. Tako da to nije fizička radnja. Mi smo na Facebook-u, kao BroadTail FitKinis, ime mog brenda je BroadTail i to zapravo znači “velika pozadina” i to BroadTail ima to značenje za nas, da… (obe se smeju) Da, na Instagramu smo sa Official BroadTail i trenutno radimo na razvoju vebsajta jer smo se proširili. Evoluirali smo u kompaniju koja se bavi i zabavom. Dakle, karneval je karakterističan za Karibe? Ljudi izlaze na ulice u kostimima i plešu na ulicama ceo dan. Ova tradicija je započeta na Trinidadu i Tobagu i proširila se na Istočne Karibe, ali je postala jako jako popularna na Jamajci poslednjih dvadeset ili trideset godina. U poslednje tri godine, jedan od bendova sa Jamajke, Ksamajka, što je staro ime naše države, pre nego što je promenila ime u Jamajka, prišli su mi i rekli: “Znaš šta, ima mnogo krupnih žena na Jamajci.” Imamo mnogo žena sa oblinama. I kako su kostimi za karneval mali, mnoge krupnije žene, znaš, imaju kostim ili nose majicu ispod, ali ne bi bile u kostimu kao žene prosečne građe. Tako da su mi prišli i pitali da li bih pravila kostime za karneval za punije žene. I to smo počeli pre tri godine, i od tada se razvijamo, jer mnogi ljudi iz Severne Amerike i sa Kariba dolaze na Jamajku za karneval, posao je počeo da raste i tada smo shvatili da nam treba vebsajt i sistem slanja, tako da… Sada razvijamo vebsajt. Šaljemo kupcima koji uglavnom žive u Severnoj Americi,UK, Kanadi i na Karibima, jer su to teritorije na kojima dijaspora sa Jamajke živi i šaljemo putem DHL-a. DHL mi je partner za logistiku.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Sjajno. Da li možeš da mi kažeš nešto o stanju preduzetništva na Jamajci? Sa posebnim fokusom na žene koje vode svoje poslove. Da li je razvijeno, nerazvijeno i da li dobijate neku pomoć od države za započinjanje posla? Da li postoji neka pomoć, akceleratori i generalno koji je stav prema…
Denja Bekford: Preduzetništvu?
Sanja Milosavljevic: Preduzetništvu, ili u kojoj god branši odluče da rade.
Denja Bekford: U redu, preduzetništvo nije nešto što se tradicionalno izučavalo u školama. Ipak, u poslednjih 10 do 15 godina su se pojavili milenijalci i oni su više okrenuti preduzetništvu, i sada se preduzetništvo uči i u školama. Dosta se podstiče razvoj preduzetništva na Jamajci. I imamo dosta žena preduzetnica, ne samo u formalnom nego i neformalnom sektoru. Dopusti da ti objasnim šta mislim o neformalnom sektoru.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Da, molim te.
Denja Bekford: Dakle, na Jamajci ima dosta samohranih majki. I, majke ne samo što brinu o deci one moraju i da ih izdržavaju. I to je dovelo do mnogih inovativnih načina da se brinete o deci. To može da bude i prodavanje grickalica na ulici ili održavanje zabavnih događaja. Tako da se preduzetništvo razvija među majkama u neformalnom sektoru. Nešto moram da dodam o formalnom sektoru, preduzetništvu i ženama. Mi nemao problem da žene ne mogu da imaju pristup istim izvorima koje muškarci imaju. A to je čest slučaj ako želite da započnete posao kao žena. Ipak, ono što mi imamo, kao i mnoge druge zemlje je da obično nema dovoljno kapitala za započinjanje posla, naročito ako ste u kreativnoj industriji, kojoj pripadam jer se bavim modom. U ovom trenutku nema mnogo investicija u kreativnim industrijama. Ono što država sada radi, a to govorim kao predstavnica moje kancelarije pri Ministarstvu za kulturu, rod, zabavu i sport, je da za industrije kao što su film, animacija, muzika ili kreativna produkcija, postoje podsticaji koje možete da dobijete. Na primer, ako treba da donesete opremu iz inostranstva na Jamajku, i ako vam je odobrena pomoć za koju ste aplicirali preko Ministarstva kulture, sektor Zabave, onda zapravo možete da dobijete ono što mi zovemo “alate za rad”, oslobođene poreza.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Lepo! Odlično! Sjajno. Lepo!
Denja Bekford: Da, postoji Razvojna banka Jamajke, DBJ i ono što su oni uradili je da su otvorili nekoliko poziva na kojima možete da predstavite ideju i dobijete investicije za vaš posao. To ne mora da bude iz sektora kreativnih industrija, može biti bilo koja biznis ideja. Dosta ulažu i kroz bespovratna sredstva. To znači da nećete uvek dobiti novčanu pomoć, ali dobićete bespovratna sredstva ili kroz resurse koje mogu da vam pruže za podršku razvoja vašeg vebsajta ili da prođete neku obuku. Ovde postoji i agencija koja se zove Korporacija za razvoj poslovanja Jamajke i oni deluju kroz organizovanje treninga i inkubatora za nove preduzetnike. I sama sam održala prezentaciju pre Covid-a o brendingu vaše kompanije. Seti se, kao što sam ti rekla, moje iskustvo i znanje je iz oblasti komunikacije brenda. Oni organizuju dvonedeljne akceleratore gde ste u prilici da prođete kroz brendiranje vaše kompanije. Na primer ako ste iz sektora pakovanja, dobijete alate za taj sektor tržišta. Dakle, ovde postoji nekoliko stvari koje mogu da vas pripreme kao preduzetnika, i pošto nam je ekonomija u problemu, nema mnogo novca ali je dostupno mnogo treninga.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Da. I da li ljudi zaista i koriste ovakvu vrstu pomoći? Da li su zainteresovani da započnu i vode svoje firme?
Denja Bekford: Vidim da su mnogi mladi ljudi zainteresovani da započnu posao i vode svoje firme.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Nisu zainteresovani? Ili su zainteresovani?
Denja Bekford: Zainteresovani su.
Sanja Milosavljevic: U redu.
Denja Bekford: Da. Dakle, mnogi mladi ljudi su zainteresovani da vode svoje firme. Mislim da je generacija pre mene, mislim da su bili zadovoljni da pronađu poslove na kojima će ostati godinama i rasti zajedno sa tim poslom. Ali moja generacija, ili mlađi od mene… Zapravo sam oduševljena osobama koje su mlađe od mene jer oni žele da otvore firme dok su još u srednjoj školi. Svaki hobi žele da pretvore u posao. Mislim da zbog globalizacije vide druge mlade ljude u drugim državama kako rade tako nešto i onda žele i oni. I većina ih nije zainteresovana da radi za drugoga, žele da rade za sebe. Vrlo sam zainteresovana da vidim kako će narednih deset godina izgledati za preduzetnike sa Jamajke.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Lepo. Nas dve smo se upoznale u Americi.
Denja Bekford: Da.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Provele smo tri nedelje na IVLP programu razmene. I mi smi-
Denja Bekford: Gde sam se ja smrzavala a tebi nije smetalo. (smeh) Jer si se ti navikla na hladnoću.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Da, ja sam se navikla na hladnoću. Da li se sećaš kad smo otišle u posetu Gramen fondaciji i Gramen banci?
Denja Bekford: Da.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Da li misliš da bi mikro pozajmice pomogle ljudima da lakše započnu biznis? Ili da samo investiraju u neku opremu i samo počnu da rade nešto.
Denja Bekford: To bi definitivno pomoglo. Pomoglo bi sigurno. Dopusti da kažem nešto. Iako je proces, u smislu administracije jednostavan, započeti posao, pronaći novac za taj posao, to je teško. Lakše je dobiti kredit za kupovinu automobila na Jamajci, nego dobiti pozajmicu za započinjanje posla. Jer kako banke gledaju na to. Ako ne možeš da plaćaš mesečne rate, zaplenićemo ti automobil. Ali ako tvoj biznis ne ostvaruje prihode, šta možemo da zaplenimo? Tako da, mnoge banke nisu raspoložene ili spremne da ti daju novac za započinjanje posla, znaš. Čak i ako im pokažeš najbolje projekcije. Mislim da treba da postoji banka, i mislim da to i radi Razvojna banka Jamajke, koja bi mogla da ti da novac za poslovanje, jer budimo realni – malim preduzećima je neophodan protok novca. Zahvalna sam ja na treninzima i bespovratnim sredstvima, ali malim preduzećima treba novac. Potrebno nam je više mesta na kojima možemo da dobijemo investicije u preduzetništvo.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Dobro. Svi se mi sada suočavamo sa istim problemom. Covid-19 se dogodio u istom trenutku, na celom svetu. Kaži nam, kakva je situacija na Jamajci? I kaži nam, podeli sa nama, gde si bila kada si čula vesti? Ne mora baš precizan trenutak.
Denja Bekford: Ali ja se sećam tačnog trenutka.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Sećaš se? Zaista se sećaš? (obe se smeju)
Denja Bekford: Dakle…
Sanja Milosavljevic: Koja je bila tvoja prva reakcija na vest?
Denja Bekford: Prvi slučaj na Jamajci je zabeležen 10. marta ove godine…Bila sam u Montego beju, jednom od naših letovališta-gradova. Na Jamajci postoje dva grada Kingston i Montego bej i tražila sam lokaciju za seminar o ovim fiskalnim olakšicama za ljude u kreativnim industrijama. I baš sam govorila mom direktoru: “Znaš, pošto smo već u Montego beju, a on je sav u plažama, hajde da nađemo lokaciju sa koje će se stvarno i videti plaža”. I onda stiže vest svakome na telefon ili putem naših novinskih agencija da imamo slučaj prvog zaraženog Covid-om. Svi smo mi znali da se to dešava, gledali smo TV i nadali smo se da niko neće doneti virus kod nas. Jer nije bilo zaraženih u zemlji. To bi morao biti neko sa strane, jer se naša zemlja ozbiljno oslanja na turizam. Mi prodajemo naše predivne plaže i muziku i kreativne ideje. I znali smo da je neizbežno da dođe i kod nas. Dakle, tamo sam bila. Verujem da su mnogi mislili da je to nešto što dođe i prođe. Vrlo brzo smo uveli zabranu ulaska u zemlju. Možda smo deset dana nakon tog prvog slučaja u potpunosti zatvorili naše granice tako da nije bilo dolaznih turista. I procena države je da gubimo tri miliona dolara dnevno zbog zabrane ulaska turista na Jamajku. Turizam je povezan sa svim drugim industrijama, povezan je sa kreativnim industrijama jer mi ne samo što prodajemo plaže i predivne pejzaže, već je i naša muzika veoma važna na svetskom nivou. Mi smo dali šest originalnih muzičkih žanrova svetu, uključujući rege i denshol, što i dovodi mnoge turiste kod nas. Rekla si mi da jako voliš Bob Marlija…
Sanja Milosavljevic: Naravno… (smeh)
Denja Bekford: I zapravo, trenutno sam u Heri Džej studiju, a ovaj studio je star oko 50 godina. To je jedan od naših legendarnih studija u Kingstonu i ovde je Bob Marli snimio svojih prvih pet albuma. Sve one predivne pesme Bob Marlija koje znaš i voliš, snimane su ovde. Osećam se kao umetnica (smeh) zato šta sam ovde. I još važnije, sada je u vlasništvu njegove ćerke Tare Džonson i onda vodi ovaj studio. Ona je direktorka. Tako da mi održavamo duh osnaživanja žena kroz ovu priču. (smeh)
Sanja Milosavljevic: Odlično!
Denja Bekford: Tako je! Dakle, da nastavim, o uticaju koji Covid ima. Morali smo da ugasimo našu industriju – industriju zabave, koja je značajna za nas. Procenjuje se da je prihod od industrije zabave, od koncerata i događaja, oko 90 milijardi dolara na godišnjem nivou, ovde na Jamajci…
Sanja Milosavljevic: A sada, odjednom ništa.
Denja Bekford: Da, nula. Takođe i naš sektor poljoprivrede. U vezi sa turizmom, i naš sektor poljoprivrede je počeo da pati jer nije bilo hotela koji su kupovali poljoprivredne proizvode, dakle sve je stavljeno na pauzu. Bili smo zatvoreni skoro šest nedelja. Sada smo ukinuli policijski sat jer je naša vlada odlučila da ne možemo više da gubimo novac. I ponovo smo profunkcionisali početkom jula. Neki kažu da je to prerano, jer smo od tada imali porast broja zaraženih. Kada smo ukinuli karantin, bili smo na broju od 500 slučajeva, a sada smo na 1065. A u protekloj nedelji smo svakog dana imali oko 19 novih slučajeva. Samo u prošloj nedelji. Došlo je rasta broja zaraženih između prošle i ove nedelje. Pokušavamo…
Sanja Milosavljevic: Da li ćete uvesti neke nove mere ili ponovo uvesti karantin?
Denja Bekford: Situacija je neizvesna, jer je pre dva dana naš premijer najavio datum sledećih izbora, 3. septembra. Kada se radi o izborima, ne možeš celu zemlju da staviš u karantin jer počinje kampanja, dolaziće vam ljudi u kuće, govoriće vam da glasate za njih. Ljudima treba omogućiti da izađu iz kuća i odu na glasanje 3. septembra. Ne predviđam da će se uvesti karantin pre 3. septembra, ali verujem da će zbog novih slučajeva, uvesti stožiji policijski sat. Kod nas je sada policijski sat na snazi od 11 sati uveče do 5 sati ujutru. Ranije smo mogli da se krećemo od 5 sati ujutru do 6 sati posle podne, a kada je bio potpuni karantin, mogli smo da se krećemo od 6 sati ujutru do 3 sata posle podne. Mislim da će umesto potpune zabrane kretanja, uvesti strožiji policijski sat.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Da. Kako je to uticalo na ljude? Na običan svet? Zatvoren si, ne možeš da ideš na posao, moraš da zatvoriš radnju. Kakvog je uticaja to imalo? Da li ste samo prihvatili ili ste reagovali na takvu odluku?
Denja Bekford: Ljudi su-
Sanja Milosavljevic: Ne samo ti, već i tvoji prijatelji, kolege?
Denja Bekford: Dopusti da samo-
Sanja Milosavljevic: Ili ste samo prihvatili kao: “U redu, ovo moramo da uradimo u ovom trenutku”.
Denja Bekford: U većini slučajeva, ljudi prihvataju jer su videli šta se desilo u drugim državama, ako ste gledali na Internetu ili ste gledali TV. Na primer, u tom trenutku Italija je imala veliki broj slučajeva, Amerika, koja nam je baš blizu geografski i zato što veliki deo dijaspore živi u Americi. Videli smo šta se dešava tamo, i znali smo da mora da se uvede karantin. Efekat prelivanja je bio veliki za običnog muškarca ili ženu koji vode mala preduzeća. Jer oni u velikom procentu zavise od velikih preduzeća sa kojima sarađuju kao dobavljači i sa manjim neformalnim biznisima. Novac koji zaradite u toku dana je ono što koristite da prehranite sebe i porodicu. A mnogi Jamajčani tako žive. Bilo je baš teško, naročito za moje kolege u industriji zabave. Sada su potpuno zatvoreni. Nema dešavanja, festivala, koncerata. Bilo je baš stresno, mislim svako se trudi da izađe na Internet sada i organizuje neku vrstu lajv dešavanja, ali ne zarađuju mnogo od ove vrste aktivnosti. Imam primer. Moja najbolja prijateljica je oduvek želela da otvori firmu u oblasti događaja, produkcije i menadžmenta. I otvorila je firmu u januaru a onda je došao karantin u martu. Uložila je skoro 5 miliona dolara u opremu, jer će iznajmljivati i opremu. Uložila je sve a onda je došlo do zastoja u poslovanju. Bilo je teško, ali niko ne protestvuje jer ljudi razumeju. Mislim, ljudi iz industrije zabave su morali da lobiraju za delimično ukidanje karantina… krajem jula su počela prva dešavanja, ali sa 250 ljudi. I to se smanjuje, jer 250 ljudi ne može da donese novac nikome, za bilo koji događaj.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Naravno.
Denja Bekford: To je više bilo da bismo se relaksirali nego da bismo zaradili neki novac. Ali moraćemo da vidimo šta će se desiti posle izbora i kako će se cela stvar razvijati. Osećam da su mnogi frustrirani. U početku smo svi bili uplašeni, nosili smo maske, dezinfikovali ruke i održavali fizičku distancu. Poslednjih nekoliko nedelja-
Sanja Milosavljevic: Da li to radite i dalje? Ovde, u Srbiji, i dalje praktikujemo fizičku distancu, redovno peremo ruke, kako je kod vas?
Denja Bekford: Radili smo to i na Jamajci, ali pošto su ljudi bili dugo zatvoreni, ponekad vidite da ne poštuju fizičku distancu. Na primer, Jamajka je zemlja u kojoj ljudi vole da se dodiruju. Volimo da vas dodirujemo, da vas grlimo, da plešemo blizu vas, takvi smo. Bilo je mnogo obraćanja javnosti na TV-u i na radiju da nas podsete da je Covid-19 još uvek ovde, da ga ne uzimamo zdravo za gotovo, da nastavimo sa dezinfekcijom, da nastavimo da nosimo maske… (obe se smeju), znaš. I dalje je to jedna kriva učenja za ljude, ali mislim da su sa porastom broja zaraženih ljudi počeli da uče da moramo da radimo te stvari kako bismo smanjili krivu, tako da Korona virus jednostavno nestane.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Da li si paničila? Da li si imala nekih problema? Ti si majka, imaš bebu. Odgovorna si, ne samo za sebe, već i za nekog drugog. Da li si bila pod stresom? Da li si bila depresivna? Da li si bila u problemu? Ti imaš svoju firmu, ali radiš još negde? Šta je bila tvoja…
Denja Bekford: Da budem iskrena, nisam paničila… jer sam uvek pratila medije da vidim šta se dešava. Znala sam da će doći do nas, znala sam da moram da zaštitim dete, pa ga zato nisam ni dala u jaslice. On ima 15 meseci, i nisam ga dala u jaslice jer sam, znaš, morala sam da vidim šta će se desiti sa ovim novim virusom. Tako da mi dadilja dolazi svakog dana. Počela sam stvarno da brinem u trenutku kada sam shvatila da je dadilja iz oblasti koja je bila u potpunom karantinu pre ostatka zemlje jer su imali mnogo slučajeva zaraženih. Zato sam zvala moju majku, koja živi na ostrvu Sveta Ana, što je dva sata vožnje od mene, da dođe u Kingston i brine o mom detetu dok sam na poslu. Jer kad otvorim kompjuter, on samo viče “Epl! Epl!” i lupa po mom kompjuteru i ja ne mogu da radim. Zato je moja majka došla i pomogla mi. Govorila sam sebi, ja makar imam opciju. Mogla sam da pozovem majku da dođe i da mi pomogne. A šta je sa drugim ljudima koji nisu imali izbora, znaš? To je baš zabrinulo neke ljude. Razgovarala sam sa nekim drugim preduzetnicama, koje – iako sam i sama preduzetnica, ja imam stalni posao, pa sam računala na platu. Razumeš? Zato sam bila zahvalna jer druge osobe kao moja najbolja prijateljica, ona nema odakle da dobije platu, jer je tek uronila u preduzetništvo, tako da su to različiti izazovi za različite osobe. Iako sam imala izbora i izvora na koje mogu da računam, i dalje sam brinula. Nikoga nisam puštala u kuću, jer nisam htela da se moje dete zarazi. (smeh) Nije bilo šanse da se to desi. U stvari, on sada mrzi svoje sedište za kola jer se nigde nije vozio kolima. Pa je u fazonu, šta je sad ovo? Pa se ja pitam, kako će se moje dete navići na auto sedište jednom kada krenemo da putujemo kolima. (smeh) Dakle, dešavale su druge stvari, ali nisam paničila. Trudila sam se da ostanem pribrana, prisebna i držala se protokola kako bismo ostali bezbedni što je moguće više.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Da. Kaži mi, ono što si nam rekla o tvojoj prijateljici koja je uložila veliku sumu novca u posao koji je stao.
Denja Bekford: Pre nego što je počeo!
Sanja Milosavljevic: Pre nego što je počeo! Pa… to je baš tragedija. Kako je vaša vlada reagovala? Da li je bilo nekih podsticaja? Da li je pomogla ljudima, na primer, da ne moraju da plate poreze, ili ne moraju da plate zakup lokala ili… koju vrstu pomoći je vaša vlada i donosioci politika ponudila ljudima koji vode svoja preduzeća?
Denja Bekford: U redu, moram da kažem da su brzo došli do neke vrste paketa pomoći. Paket, cela stvar se zove C.A.R.E. To je akronim, ne mogu da se setim šta znači ali se odnosi na paket pomoći. Ponudili su olakšice u različitim oblastima za različite vrste ljudi. Uglavnom za sektor turizma. Bilo je dosta onih koji su imali neku korist od toga, ali morao si da budeš registrovan, da imaš poreski identifikacioni broj, PIB. Ako nisi imao taj broj a vlasnik si nekog biznisa, morao si da pružiš dokaz da plaćaš poreze. Na taj način se i vlada osigurala da svi sada plaćaju svoje poreze. (smeh) Tako da… (smeh) Neki- (smeh) Mnogi preduzetnici ovde, naročito iz sektora industrije zabave su, znaš, malo negodovali zbog plaćanja poreza. (smeh) Tako da, to im je bio način da prikupe informacije pomažući preduzetnicima. Moje ministarstvo – kulture, roda, zabave i sporta – mi nismo bili uključeni u taj paket pomoći na početku, pa smo lobirali da naši korisnici dobiju neku vrstu-
Sanja Milosavljevic: Kako to, izvini što te prekidam, kako to da tvoje ministarstvo nije bilo uključeno u paket pomoći?
Denja Bekford: Ovde postoji nešto… kulturološki je uslovljeno, što moramo da ispravimo ovde na Jamajci. Mi mislimo da su kreativne industrije neformalne i stalno to koristimo za oslobađanje od stresa i za dovođenje turista u zemlju, ali ih ne cenimo koliko bi trebalo. I zato, jer je turizam bio ugašen i uključio se u toliko drugih industrija, paket pomoći je bio dosta fokusiran ili na turizam ili na poljoprivredu. Sada, naša ministarka, Olivija Grandž, žena, mora da lobira za nas kako bismo imali uticaja na davanje podsticaja kreativnoj industriji. I do danas, novac nije podeljen, ali smo prikupili 40 miliona dolara za kreativce kako bi dobili neku vrstu podsticaja.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Da. Dobro. Uh, to je baš teško, naročito za države koje zavise od turizma. Mislim, naš turizam, sektor turizma u Srbiji je praktično ugašen. Ljudi zatvaraju svoje firme i kancelarije, i…
Denja Bekford: I mi se i dalje borimo.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Naravno!
Denja Bekford: U pravu si, ali šta se desilo sa tobom, sa proizvodnjom testenina?
Sanja Milosavljevic: I dalje vodim firmu, ali sam morala da je transformišem malo, jer restorani ne rade, ali ljudi i dalje moraju da jedu. Tako da sam se okrenula fizičkim licima umesto restoranima ili, nekoj drugoj vrsti kupaca.
Denja Bekford: Ono što je u porastu na Jamajci je to da nismo bili posebno snažni u dostavi. Tako da, sa pojavom Covid 19 dosta dostavnih mesta se pojavilo.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Znam, razgovarala sam sa Feng iz Kine, rekla mi je istu stvar. Imali su kurirske službe i ranije, pre-
Denja Bekford: COVID-19
Sanja Milosavljevic: Ali sada, ne znam, to je industrija koja cveta, zapravo. Logistika i dostavne službe. Koliko su mali biznisi morali da se transformišu da bi se prilagodili novim poslovnim modelima ili da rade više na e-commerce platformama, ili… kako su se promenili? Da li više nego ranije cene svoje kupce?
Denja Bekford: Mislim mislim, naravno, kao što sam pomenula, restorani su morali da osmisle nov način rada. Sada ima dosta usputnih mesta za podizanje robe i dostava. Skoro svi su sada dostavljači. Nekada nisi mogao da nađeš kuriira – sada su svi kuriri.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Stvarno?
Denja Bekford: Znaš, (smeh) ti poslovi su sada eksplodirali. Počinju da rastu. Uz uspostavljanje rada od kuće u korporacijama, shvatili su da su svi sastanci – jer Jamajka voli da održava sastanke. Volimo da se sastajemo. I volimo da se sastajemo na lepim mestima, kao što su velike sale. (smeh)
Sanja Milosavljevic: Isto je i ovde. Isto je i ovde. (smeh)
Denja Bekford: Niko se više ne sastaje na taj način, svi koji mogu da organizuju virtualni sastanak, to postaje budućnost osmišljavanja novog načina rada firmi. Mnogi preduzetnici se oslanjaju na vebsajtove sada, jer nema fizičkog odlaska u radnja. To su, za Jamajku, ugostiteljska industrija, gastronomija, industrije koje su se najviše transformisale.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Da. Da li vidiš svetlo na kraju tunela?
Denja Bekford: Mora da postoji.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Šta misliš, kada će se ekonomija Jamajke oporaviti? Ili početi da se oporavlja? Kažeš da će se održati izbori 3. septembra. Da li misliš da je to taj dan, ili? Šta misliš, kada će ekonomija početi da se oporavlja? I koje korake moramo da preduzmemo da bismo oporavili ekonomiju?
Denja Bekford: Za mene, onako kako ja vidim putanju dešavanja, naročito sa porastom broja zaraženih koji se dešava, ne mislim da ćemo se oporaviti do 2022. godine. A to je cela godina od danas. Na početku, procenjivali smo da će stvari možda proći do oktobra. Ali, naročito za kreativne industrije, jer mi zavisimo od događaja, muzike i kulture, koje su gurale našu ekonomiju. Nema velikih festivala koji se dešavaju do kraja sledeće, do 2022. godine. Jer, čak i da festivali počnu da se održavaju, moraju da se ponovo osmisle, iz dva razloga. Prvi: bez vakcine, ljudi se i dalje plaše da budu u masi. Bez vakcine, ljudi koji vode ove velike festivale, česte kod nas, moraju da ulože mnogo više resursa i postoji mogućnost da ne ostvare profit od događaja od kojih su navikli da generišu profit. Tako da je potrebno ponovo zamisliti stvari. Ono što mislim da vlada mora da uradi je, jer smo blizu izbora, moramo da uvedemo novi karantin. Po mojoj proceni, kako bi kontrolisali nove slučajeve. Ono što se dešava sada, iako postoje slučajevi koji su došli sa strane, virus počinje da se širi zajednicom, a to ne želimo, jer će onda biti teže da kontrolišemo virus i da pratimo kontakte. Postoje osobe koje rade u velikim organizacijama i velikim zgradama koje rade zajedno, i morali su da zatvore svoja vrata jer je jedna osoba obolela od Covid-19 i nisu sigurni da li je potrebno testirati sve kontakte. Kad imaš takvo širenje virusa u zajednici vreme je za novi policijski sat. Tokom ovog policijskog sata, verujem da će vlada morati da osmisli novi način kako da pomogne preduzetnicima i biznisima da ne propadnu, jer mala preduzeća su žila kucavica jedne zemlje, znaš…
Sanja Milosavljevic: Znam, znam, slažem se. To je istina.
Denja Bekford: A to im se ne priznaje uvek, oni su žila kucavica ekonomije jedne zemlje, i bez njih, ekonomija će stradati. Mislim da će mnogi propisi morati da se sastave kako bi se osiguralo da se biznisi ne ugase. I naročito, nastaviću da radim za industriju zabave, jer je važna za nas, jer je neraskidivo povezana za turizam, i da, moramo da nađemo načina, kroz više testiranja, kroz bolje upravljanje osoba koje dolaze u zemlju da bismo osigurali da ne ugrozimo naše stanovništvo.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Da li misliš da možete da odložite izbore za neko drugo vreme?
Denja Bekford: To se neće desiti.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Septembar – nije moguće ili imate samo jedan dan da organizujete izbore u naredne četiri godine?
Denja Bekford: Ne, ne!
Sanja Milosavljevic: Jer ako-
Denja Bekford: Ustavno-
Sanja Milosavljevic: Šalim se, naravno, ali…
Denja Bekford: Znam (smeh), znam. Prema Ustavu, izbori moraju da se održe do februara 2021. godine.
Sanja Milosavljevic: U redu.
Denja Bekford: Na početku širenja Covid-19 u našoj zemlji, lideri drugih država su nas hvalili jer su videli da se dobro snalazimo u ograničavanju širenja virusa. Sa porastom broja zaraženih, naš premijer, po mojoj proceni, jer sam ja komunikator brenda i pratim PR, gubi na publicitetu. Jer se dešava porast broja zaraženih. Takođe, imali smo i slučajeve korupcije u protekle četiri godine i on gubi kredibilitet. Tako da, da sam ja političarka, ma koliko to loše zvučalo, sad je najbolje vreme da raspiše izbore, da bismo mogli da osmislimo strategije. Ali kao građanka, mislim da nije pravi trenutak. Mislim da je to izbor između dva zla.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Znam, mi smo imali sličnu situaciju ovde u junu mesecu i imali smo dva talasa porasta broja zaraženih. Imali smo prvi talas i mislili smo da će sve biti u redu. Onda su se održali izbori i imali smo novi talas, tako da, to je samo iskustvo iz naše zemlje. I šta sada? Da li želiš da vratiš vreme, u recimo decembar 2019. ili februar 2020? Da li želiš da se vratiš u to vreme nevinosti? Jer za mene je to vreme nevinosti. Sada, moramo da budemo pažljiviji, oprezniji, nosimo maske, dezinfikujemo ruke, ne verujemo ćak ni komšijama. Pa, da li bi se vratila u taj period, ili da li (smeh), da li želiš da prigrliš promenu koju će nam ovo stanje doneti?
Denja Bekford: Za mene je to mač sa dve oštrice. U februaru smo proslavili mesec regea. To je bio izuzetno uspešan mesec rege muzike. Trebalo je i ti da dođeš na Jamajku za proslavu rođendana Bob Marlija 6. februara.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Znam, znam.
Denja Bekford: Za nas je februar bilo vreme sreće. Proslavljali smo našu muziku, već 50 godina je naša muzika podarena svetu, tako da je to bilo divno vreme za nas. Bili smo u slavljeničkom raspoloženju. Tako da bih volela da se vratim tome. Ipak, verujem da se sve dešava sa razlogom, ma koji to razlog bio. Mislim da nam je potreban reset. Da li je ovo vrsta reseta koji sam zamišljala? Nikada. Ali takođe verujem da će mnoge industrije pojaviti nakon krize kao što je ova. Lično, moja mantra je – Pronađi priliku u krizi. I nakon svih razgovora koje sam vodila sa kolegama preduzetnicima, to je ono što sam videla. Šta možeš da izvučeš iz ove krize što će nam omogućiti da pronađemo ili steknemo – novu veštinu, poboljšamo naša preduzeća ili učinimo naše živote boljim. Ja sam postala stpljiva. Nikada nisam bila strpljiva, a molila sam se za strpljenje. I shvatila sam da strpljenje nije samo čekanje, to je način na koji čekamo. I samo sam pokušala da poboljšam sebe učenjem o trendovima koji se dešavaju u modi i marketingu, pa kad ponovo osmislim moju kompaniju – jer u ovom trenutku niko ne ide na plaže. Nema plaže. Zatvorili su trideset plaža na Jamajci. Tako da se kupaći kostimi baš i ne kupuju. Ali osmislila sam nove stilove. Razgovarala sam sa ljudima o organizovanju virtualne modne revije. Želela sam da organizujem BroadTail fashion nedelju mode, i nikada nisam do kraja razradila ideju a moraću do kraja godine. Ali ova situacija izvlači nove načine rada iz nas. Osećam se da se možda veliki festivali neće desiti, ali mislim da će se izroditi nova generacija promotera događaja iz ovoga. Možda su mali intimni događaji ono što bi trebalo da radimo. Možda je različito, malo, sa manjim brojem ljudi a i vile su se žalile da veliki hoteli dominiraju nad svima. Pojaviće se neki novi ljudi i osećam kad sve prođe, nadam se da neće biti mnogo smrtnh slučajeva na svetu i znam da će nešto dobro izaći iz ovoga.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Da. Slažem se. I, ko bi rekao da smo stigle do kraja našeg razgovora?
Denja Bekford: Imam osećaj kao da je bilo dva minuta.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Stvarno je brzo prošlo.
Denja Bekford: Da.
Sanja Milosavljevic: I koja bi bila tvoja poruka svetu? Šta bi volela da podeliš sa ljudima ovde u Srbiji i u ostaku sveta?
Denja Bekford: Nešto drugo osim da slušaju rege muziku?
Sanja Milosavljevic: Slušajte rege muziku! To je(smeh) zdravorazumski! To je zdravorazumski! Svi treba da slušamo rege!
Denja Bekford: U redu, moja lekcija ljudima je da pronađu priliku u krizi. Uvek postoji način da izađemo snažniji iz ove situacije. Ponovo osmislite način na koji radite stvari. Mislim da nas je ovaj period izbacio iz ravnoteže jer smo verovatno previše uljuljkani u način na koji je svet funkcionisao, sa svim izazovima koji su se desili i svakodnevno smo obavljali naše poslove i onda smo se probudili jedno jutro i svet su suočio sa istim problemom. Što je verovatno i faktor ujedinjenja. Možda je došlo vreme da stavimo sa strane naše klasne tendencije, rasne tendencije, ili bilo koje druge tendencije vezane za kvalitet i da samo pokušamo da učinimo svet boljim mestom kroz deljenje. Bićemo sposobni da ponovo osmislimo život i još jedna važna stvar, Sanja. Rege muzika je uvek bio ritam moje zemlje i to je vrsta muzike koja ti pruža isceljenje u izazovnim vremenima, jer je rođena u periodu velikih izazova u mojoj zemlji, i tako da ponovo osmišljavaš svoj život, slušaj rege muziku.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Hvala ti mnogo. Zaista cenim tvoje vreme i cenim što si ustala u 5 sati ujutru.
Denja Bekford: Da, zato što si ti moja prijateljica! Uradila bih to za tebe! Ti si mi prva ponudila jaknu i šal kada sam se smrzavala u Vašingtonu, trudna. Uradila bih sve za tebe! Nikada ti to neću zaboraviti.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Hvala ti mnogo. I nadam se ako želiš da pokreneš nešto slično na Jamajci, mogu da ti pomognem sa iskustvom koji sam stekla ovde.
Denja Bekford: Mislim da je predivan projekat na kojem radiš i želim da ti čestitam na tome. I zaista me inspirisalo da razgovaram sa ženama širom sveta, takođe, o tome sa čim su se suočile i kako možemo to da prevaziđemo zajedno, jer budućnost je ženskog roda, zar ne? Ne mislim da su muškarci…
Sanja Milosavljevic: Budućnost je ženskog roda.
Denja Bekford: Da, jeste…
Sanja Milosavljevic: Hvala ti, šaljem zagrljaje i poljupce iz Beograda!
Denja Bekford: I sa Jamajke.
Sanja Milosavljevic: Ćao!
Denja Bekford: Zdravo!